Wed 18 Oct 2006
Love in the 21st Century
Posted by cindy under Mental States , Wedding Memories , Work Crap at 3:49 pm[23] Comments
I’m at my desk processing paper divorces. In reviewing these files, I see a trend. The parties are married for a short number of years, and then I look down and see they have offspring(s) of the marriage listed. The offspring are often older than the length of the marriage. So I can only imagine that the people had a kid or two together, didn’t get married for awhile, and then decided, “Eh, let’s do it, let’s make it official,” and then in a short married time they realize it doesn’t work.
This isn’t criticism, since I have no experience in this arena, but don’t they know beforehand that it wouldn’t work? I mean, there’s gotta be SOME reason the two hesitated in getting married when they first got pregnant, right? So if they knew then they aren’t compatible, why bother getting married when the kid’s like 4, and then it turns out they were right originally and they SHOULDN’T be together, but now they have to go thru formal divorce proceedings and explain to the kid why mommy and daddy aren’t gonna live together anymore? What happened there? Anyone have any stories/examples for me? I don’t think this is about a woman getting knocked up to trap a man, since if that was gonna work, they would’ve gotten married before the kid’s that old. I just don’t understand why, if you’re already holding back, you’d go ahead and take the plunge so much later.
And then it makes me wonder about other stuff, too. My mom says that today’s society is so full of divorce because people (in this country) don’t value the relationship enough to compromise. People these days are selfish, and if something doesn’t make them happy, they just up and leave instead of work toward a solution. Sure there are things you shouldn’t stay and accept (cheating, abuse, etc.), but there are a lot smaller things that people leave over these days. Like finding a porn magazine in his briefcase. I used to think that going from relationship to relationship is just the dues you have to pay to eventually make it to The One. But now I wonder whether today’s fast-paced world doesn’t leave room for The One, it’s just whatever fits in your lifestyle or desires right now, i.e. Mr. Right vs. Mr. Right Now. Life and times and careers and friends keep evolving, so maybe someone perfect for you now would no longer fit in in a few years when you advance in your career or develop new interests. We’re no longer in a small town life where you can marry your high school sweetheart and stay together forever because all you’ll be doing from that time on would be minding the farm together, and if he can milk a cow now, he’s gonna be great at milking the cow later, and nothing’s gonna change. But if it’s true that life today doesn’t lend itself to stability, then why contractually obligate yourself to anyone? It’s like building an expensive house on a fault line when you know earthquakes hit there every few years and plate techtonics will tear the property apart as a law of nature.
Isn’t that freaking scary?! To think that we may no longer be able to make a beeline toward a juicy rewarding hive; that we’re just spending life flitting from flower to flower, forever.
I’m not sure why some couples fail after spending a few/several years together, get married and divorce within a couple years. Those that I know that have done this, have stated “he changed” or “she changed” after they exchanged vows. I’m not sure how someone could change so much after already dating them (or even living together) suddenly after marrying said person.
I’m at fault for being one of those people who’ve left a marriage and/or relationship because of reasons others wouldn’t blink at.
I discovered with my 2nd (and last marriage), there hadn’t been full disclosure on a lot of things.. shocked at some of these findings, I let it destroy something that probably could have been saved.
I’ve learned a lot in the last several years .. and have had a lot of time for personal growth, which I needed. I wasn’t interested in such things because I was too involved with everyone else (kids, spouse, work).
I think it’s too easy to get married and almost as easy (and not necessarily less expensive) to get a divorce. I think you can even file for a divorce online. I really believe that so many people are holding out for something better, thus putting off marriage to someone they’re with now. I believe your mother is correct in thinking we are all so selfish… we really are.
I think we still face some of the issues people had when divorce wasn’t such an easy option… the difference is, nobody talked about it then and it was shameful.
Today.. divorce is just another word that starts with the letter d.
We’re sad.
I’ve thought a lot about the same thing… I think that many people these days ARE looking for Mr./Ms. Right Now. They ARE selfish. It’s like having someone to come home to, even if you don’t like them all that much, because they fit the bill for now and they’re a boy to warm up to or have sex with.
I also get scared sometimes because I personally am fearful of change. Because you know, I like my boyfriend. I don’t want to become someone who is so engulfed in my own goals and whatever else that I would just want to leave him. Because I don’t WANT to leave him! But honestly? I feel more afraid on my part because I’m younger and he’s older and I am just coming out of college. Then again, I guess he could always feel the need to find someone else, too. EEGAD.
Omg. I just realized that when I comment on your blogs I end up going on and on about myself! This is embarrassing. So in quick summary, my point is that I think that the thought of WANTING to flit from flower to flower and never being satisfied is a scary thought, too. Scary, scary thought.
Jordan – Thanks for your story. You’re right, the fact that divorce these days are no big deal, makes it less psychologically hindering to take that step.
PL – You’re SUPPOSED to tell me your personal experience, I requested it on this post. I wanna know what your take on this is, and sometimes people have to give personal experience as context for their opinions. I really appreciate your disclosure. I also agree with you, the thought of WANTING to flit flower to flower is scary.
Everyone else – I’m not writing another post until I get more feedback on this.
Just started reading your blog, but I’ll comment on this.
Yes, most people don’t know what it takes to make a relationship work. They think that it’s just magic and everything will fall into place like a magical game of tetris. But it’s not, it takes compromise, patience, understanding, trust. One person may not like everything about the other person, and they’ll think they can change them. Or they’ll change over the years, as everybody does, then realize that they haven’t changed in the same direction, their goals in life aren’t the same, and decide to leave because of that.
Some things are minor that everybody has to cope with, like one person being messy, while other things are not so minor, such as life goals not matching.
Unfortunately alot of people treat marriage like a bf/gf relationship. That they can get out of it any time they want. For better or For worse has no meaning to them, they only think of For better, and will drop the other person as soon as things get worse. People also get married to save a relationship thinking that marriage will cure some of their relationship ills. Unfortunatel it does not unless they take appropriate action to address their original problems.
While I was speaking in general terms, I just ended a 3 year relationship. The reasons given to me were over small, stupid things, while things that were left unsaid were bigger, aka life goals weren’t matching, she had none, while I had alot.
James – Well, welcome to my blog! And I LOVE magical games of Tetris! But yeah, you make a good point that I think is especially true of young people’s marriages. People are going to change and grow, and it takes a lot of work to stay flexible as both people go thru their metamorphoses. I think sometimes different doesn’t mean uncompatible, but in other situations such as yours, maybe the differences were too big to bridge. At least you didn’t have to get a divorce, and I presume no children were involved.
See, that’s another thing that scares me. Assuming that people these days are constantly changing and need to stay flexible and mobile to adapt to these changes, it seems like the permanent things we add to our lives along the way (marriage or children) are just like nails hammered on a growing root into the ground. It’s gonna get torn up, and it’s gonna leave a mark. The nails are great for support if the roots don’t grow and change anymore, but how do you know which kind of root you are?
Since I am in the middle of a divorce for a marriage that only lasted 18 months I feel I am qualified to respond to this topic.
1. People will get a divorce these days because they have options. Women make their own money. Men have microwavable food. Parties don’t feel they need each other.
2. Not only do people feel they have choices, I think people get so caught up in their “own” lives that they no longer work on the marriage. You can spend quality time after work with your spouse or you could be on the computer. Sadly, many people choose the computer.
3. I don’t think married people were happier “back then,” they were just willing to stay married because there were no other options and it was a social taboo to get divorced. I’m sure there are also many unhappy marriages. Some people put up with it their whole lives (while never really being happy), some choose to make a change.
4. Many people get married for the wrong reasons. “It’s about time.” “I don’t want to be old and single.” “He is tall and makes good money.” “I want to wear a wedding dress and a big diamond ring.”
Maybe my marriage would have worked if I stayed and worked on it some more. I will be the first to say that getting a divorce was my idea and there are times when I feel I was being selfish. Nevertheless, I am happier for my decision, and the decision was not an easy one to make.
Vicks – Your #1 made me laugh. Your #2 made me sad. Your #3 made me think. Your #4 made me reconsider my reason for wanting to get married. You mean “tall” isn’t a good enough reason?
Seriously tho, I feel that you did try to work on your marriage but were not getting anywhere because it takes two to fix a problem that involves 2 people.
i wasn’t going to respond, but since i’ve received an email from cindy, i guess i will.
i don’t think that love in the 21st century has changed from love in the 18th century. society, however, has changed. yes, it is true that there are far more divorces today than ever before. part of that, i believe, is because divorce is far more accepted today than ever before. it used to be that for religious reasons, people do not believe in divorce. it used to be that more people used to be more devout. it used to be that being divorced automatically had a negative connotation. well, it isn’t so much the case anymore.
but love…love has not changed. i think it really just depends on how you decide you want to approach love. for me, finding the person that i want to spend the rest of my life with is really the endgame. it’s about finding someone that i love, it’s about finding someone that i can share my daily life with, and above all else, it’s about finding someone that i can do all of these things for the rest of my life. it’s easy when you first start dating someone to have tunnel vision and not look too far into the future. it’s easy to ignore major issues in a relationship because “it’s not that serious yet”. it’s the approach, though, that matters. i’ve made my mistakes in the past about looking the other way when it comes to dating someone and having major differences. eventually, i had to face the issues and decide what i could and could not live with.
i think a lot of people go into marriages that have problems or are unhappy these days, but i think that they more readily go into these marriages because there’s an out. an acquaintence of mine said prior to getting married that if things don’t work out, she could always get divorced as if that option wasn’t a big deal!! i don’t get people like that, and i don’t date people like that either.
yes, there are plenty of people who do think like that and yes, it can be a scary proposition to think that that might happen to you, but i believe that you have control of that. you decide who you date, you decide if they are someone that you want to spend the rest of your life with, and most importantly, you are the the one who can find out if your life goals match theirs.
yes, it’s true, people can change over time. i know that i’m not the same person i was 10 years ago. i’ve definitely changed in the last 5 years, even. i think the nature of a successful relationship is that you have a strong foundation that will build upon changes that you go through in your and your significant other’s lives. if you are already on shaky ground, it’s hard to build a successful and non-dysfunctional relationship from there.
but the fact of the matter is that some people can change so much that they just aren’t the person that they were long ago. it’s true, it could happen. i think that it is far better to be divorced and happy than to stay in an unhappy marriage for the rest of your life. you deserve better than that.
i think that so long as you have goals about where you want your relationship to go, you should take steps to make sure that the goal is the same one as the person you are dating. so long as you guys are in sync, it should be just fine.
my advice? only date people who are cool.
only date people who are cool.
HOWL.
haha
I was on the same page as Wilco regarding responding until yesterday. At first I thought what input could I give? I am not married and have never been married. Plus, I recently became engaged and divorce was the last thing I wanted to think about. Then it hit me, I do have input! My parents divorced when I was in the 4th grade and that is the model I grew up with. Even though my parents were not your typical divorced parent (they actually got along) that is the model that was ingrained in my head. During my last relationship we became engaged *gagging at the thought!*. I knew he was not “the one” but my life plan was to get married (because after 7 years of dating that seemed like the next logical step), have a couple of kids and then we would divorce. And here is the shocker . . . I was OK with that plan. I was young and obviously very immature! Looking back I am thankful that I didn’t go through with it! I was just settling for the person I felt comfortable with and doing what seems next on “to do list” of life. I tell people this old thought process of mind and their jaw drops. The people you see filing for divorce might another person who is just following the only model of a marriage they know of.
THERE’S the thoughtful relationship guru Wilco that I know. Your mention of going into a marriage with an escape route in mind kinda struck a chord. I guess that’s what Vanessa is saying, also. The marriage never really stood a chance if they figured they’ll likely be divorced later anyway. I think it was in the movie The Sweetest Thing in which Cameron Diaz’s character was able to talk a bride out of cold feet right before the ceremony by telling the bride, “…and besides, if it doesn’t work out, you could always get a divorce!” The bride instantly cheered up and said, “You’re right! Haha! I’m gonna get MARRIED!” and ran out of the bathroom all happy to the altar. Admittedly, watching that made me feel relieved, too, that a mistake may not be permanent.
Now, suddenly I feel ashamed for the relief. 🙁
here’s the thing, we are all human. the human condition is one of imperfection. that’s actually what makes it perfect. follow me for a second here, it is completely OK to make a mistake. yes, despite your chinese upbringing, you need to know this. it is ok not to be perfect. it is ok if you make mistakes. i’m officially giving you permission to do so.
what is not ok is to not live your life in fear of making mistakes. life is a learning process, so you go, live a little, make a mistake (read: pine over RAT BASTARD) and then realize that you did make a mistake and take steps not to make it again (read: stop thinking about RAT BASTARD).
* looking over toward Diana *
going to check Diana’s blog for more template changes now.. uhoh
can someone just marry me so i don’t have to work anymore? 🙁
Oh, you love your job, you masochist. 🙂
no, really, i am hating it today!
But you just quashed a big fire today! You’re a hero!
oh, with respect to what your mom said, my mom thinks that, too. i guess chinese parents do think alike.
i don’t know about that yet – we are still waiting for confirmation that our courier will get in line on time. but i am keeping my fingers crossed.
I got married at 18, one month out of high school. Neither of us wanted kids. Why did I get married? Was it to get out of the house? I’m not sure, it just happened. At that age I thought I could live with him and put up with anything that came my way. He was tall, dark, and handsome. Had a degree, good job, 11 years older than me. That’s the kicker. He had lived SO much more life than me. I had odd jobs for 6 years of the marriage then went back to college, got MY degree, discovered life and the big world that is out there. I changed DRASTICALLY. I grew up A LOT. I’m not the same person I was 10 years ago and 100% of the people that knew me then would agree.
I live with my bf now after dating almost a year. We are both on the same page that we work for NOW. If in 5 years we have changed as people and do not fit together anymore then so be it. Marriage is no rush for either of us. Things are working great right now. If it becomes a priority then we will talk about it then. I don’t want to feel any pressure to “MAKE” something work for the sake of staying together. Life tosses us in a lot of directions.
Just my take on things…
Ok, Jordan twisted my arm so I guess I better post my thoughts like it or not :).
For a guy marriage is a scary thing. We have to make sure we pick the right person (but then.. how do you REALLY know?). The way the laws are set up in the US (and especially in california) puts men at a disadvantage.
Cindy mentioned she knew someone that was happily married. The guy was faithful, but his wife cheats on him so they get a divorce. She takes half of everything he has and since they were married for 10 years (and in CA) he has to pay alimoney for the rest of his/her life? For what? Her Mistake? Ouch.
A prenup can help a little but that only goes so far. Plus there’s that whole stigma of getting a prenup. “But, if you love me why do we need that?”. Even if we feel it is absolutely unnecessary — it is easy to be blinded by love so we really wouldn’t know if we needed it or not would we?
To be honest, there isn’t too much in it for us guys to get married, while at the same time we take on a LOT of risk — life changing risks, as mentioned before.
Realistically we can get everything we need without being married. Companionship, love, sex, etc. The only thing that (IMO) it is mandatory for is to start a family. At that point it really is for the benefit of the kids. They need to grow up in a family environment. I really believe if you’re going to have kids they should grow up with a traditional family with both mom and dad.
The whole concept of marriage is great though. I mean spending the rest of your life with the one person you truly love happily ever after? Who wouldn’t want that? If you can find that — it’s wonderful. The problem is finding that is not easy, and not obvious. You may learn after a few years that the person you married isn’t what you thought he/she was. For men, the law can really screw us at this point as usually the court will favor the woman in case of divorce.
So… Why do it? To find true love? To start a family? Both good reasons. But the risk involved is really scary.
Flat Coke – Thanks for your personal experience story! I also believe that the chances of outgrowing someone you got together with really young is extremely high. My personality was not set at 18, and I hardly expect a guy’s to be, either. So the taking it one day at a time is going well for you? That seems to be the most practical relationship to have if people are not planning to have kids, if there weren’t such the last-generation ideals hanging over so many of us, in the shadow of we’re-not-normal-if-we’re-not-married-by-x-age.
James – nice male perspective on things. As you know, I agree with you on all of these things. I just didn’t really think about it from the male perspective when I was writing this post. Yeah, men have a lot of material assets to lose, and women are getting more manipulative about it. You’re right; prenups in CA are invalid when it comes to child support. A woman can’t legally waive support going to her child, so even if she signed a prenup saying she won’t take any money, there’s nothing to say she won’t take his money thru her kid. I think a man’s best bet these days is to find a woman who already has her own stuff. The fact that she’s spent her life collecting her own assets means she doesn’t expect to depend on a man or wait for a man to come wipe her butt financially.